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 Nature of raffles

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MythSearcher
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PostSubject: Nature of raffles   Sat Apr 06, 2013 9:17 am

I am quoting from this link:
http://www.fantasicaunofficial.com/t5260p30-win-5-te-1millluna-entry-fee-7-spaces-leftrisk-free-scam-free-win-5te

sGabe4 wrote:
I don't think this is such a good idea.
I know you probably have no bad intentions, but many people have been scammed in "raffles" before.
You should close this thread...

Ah, I think you don't really need to scam on this one.
This is too obviously a very good(and greedy) way of making TE for the holder, 40 participants, each will give 3TE,
so the holder gets 120TE, and only need to give out 30TE and Patricia at the conclusion.
Patricia, which is at most 30TE worth, means basically at least a pure 60TE profit(and I wish people luck to be able to sell a Patricia for 30TE, TC got a person selling for 25 right now, so, a 65/120 profit, or 54+%)

You don't need to really scam for TE, the raffle system itself is so unbalanced that the raffle holder can earn so much from continual holding raffles that it is counter intuitive to scam out of that.
Actually,

A fairer raffle system will increase the prizes according to the number of participants.
For example, enter fee 1 TE.
If less than 5 participants, prizes will be 3TE.
5~10 Participants, prizes will be 6TE, 1st prize 4TE, 2nd 2TE.
11~15 Participants, prizes will be 12 TE, 1st prize 6TE, 2nd 4TE, 3rd 2TE.
16~20 Participants, prizes will be 17TE, 1st prize 8TE, 2nd 5TE, 3rd 2TE, 4th&5th 1TE each.
etc. etc.

Raffle holder will have a chance of losing 1TE in all cases, so the holder is also paying 1TE to enter, but will have a chance of winning 4TE max(if there's a max number of people in that tier participating), while other participants will have chances of winning a really large amount, which further attracts people to join.

Or simpler, depending on the number of TE collected, raffle holder will take 1%, and give 50% of it to 1st winner, 25% to 2nd place, and 24% to 3rd~nth.

Of course, if I see a raffle that is so fair, I will start worrying about scamming issue, but securities aside, this is the kind of raffle I will enter, instead of one that is so obviously the raffle holder is making greedy profit.
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masta518
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:09 am

MythSearcher wrote:
tl;dr
No need to scam on anything really, but always possibility to be even more greedy!
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ElysianField
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:11 am

CardCaptorSophia wrote:
!!CURRENT RAFFLE ON HOLD DUE TO SPECULATION OF SCAMMING! WTF?!!
QUICK RAFFLE SO I CAN GAIN TRUST AND REFERENCES FOR NOT BEING A SCAMMER! WANTING TO BUILD REPUTATION FOR BEING A LEGIT RAFFLE HOLDER

so she/he is buying people's trust with 5Te.

CardCaptorSophia wrote:
This will be proof that i am trust worthy and am NOT 100% NOT A SCAMMER!
double negative is positive.

This will be proof that i am trust worthy and am NOT 100%

CardCaptorSophia wrote:
Contact me In-game or PM or kik

Meaning if she/he scams it won't be public.

CardCaptorSophia wrote:
This Raffle is so that I can gain the trust of You and future participants

Meaning she/he can use this ''earned'' (although i see it as bought) trust to scam big numbers.

CardCaptorSophia wrote:
This first 3 raffles are going to be LUNA only, so that is it risk free!

if there is no risk why would we trust her/him if she also takes no risk?

CardCaptorSophia wrote:
I DO NOT AND NEVER INTEND ON SCAMMING ANYONE DUE TO THE FACT THAT I DO NOT WANT TO BE SCAMMED MYSELF!

No one wants to be scammed. doesn't stop those who Are scamming.


CardCaptorSophia wrote:
For people who Participate thank you for your trust and patience with this raffle. I am Thankful for your trust and will respect you for that Smile

another example : risk nothing so why would we trust her/him?

And lastly.

CardCaptorSophia wrote:
Disclaimer: Raffle prizes are not for negotiation and will not change once it has started. There will be no refunds once you have been entered into the raffle. There is no guarantee that you will win as there can be only one winner of each raffle unless stated. So enter at your own risk!

So this is the get out of jail free card.

meaning If you do get scammed. there's nothing you can do about it since you knew the risk.

My oppinion?

Ban this kind of chance games.

it's on the forum if people do get scammed on the forum there will be problems.

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GoldoaWillNotMove
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:38 am

I honestly don't see the problem if we're still allowing albuming.
Albuming is just as risky and arguably even more risky than raffles.
At least with raffles, the person has less incentive to scam you since they're already raking in TE from people participating and on the off chance that they do scam you, you only lose 2-3TE at the most.
With Albuming, the person have more incentive to scam since the only thing they get is a number increase in their profile and if you do get scammed you stand to lose a lot more since they usually happen to rare LE 6*s.
So if we're going to ban raffles then abluming should have been banned a long time ago.

Also, I don't mean to point fingers at anyone, but doesn't this count as Personal attack? I mean, we don't go around calling everyone on the forum who albums a scammer just because of album scammers..
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Happiemealz
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sat Apr 06, 2013 12:29 pm

But that's the beauty of a forum, isn't it?

An idea's put forth and everyone's allowed to have a go at it from all angles, good and bad.

Moreover so for this case, people who would have blindly participated without thinking through the possible avenues for abuse or scamming are better informed.

If the participants still choose to go ahead, then we can't say we haven't done our part as community members to talk some sense or reason into them.

I'll never participate in a raffle - all it takes is for some player with an alt account to "win" it. It's easy to stay untraceable, and even if it's a one-off, that's quite a bit of unjustified TE earned for minimal work.
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sGabe4
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:34 pm

I'd say no raffles should be allowed, but that's just MY opinion.
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ElysianField
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:38 pm

GoldoaWillNotMove wrote:
I honestly don't see the problem if we're still allowing albuming.
Albuming is just as risky and arguably even more risky than raffles.
At least with raffles, the person has less incentive to scam you since they're already raking in TE from people participating and on the off chance that they do scam you, you only lose 2-3TE at the most.
With Albuming, the person have more incentive to scam since the only thing they get is a number increase in their profile and if you do get scammed you stand to lose a lot more since they usually happen to rare LE 6*s.
So if we're going to ban raffles then abluming should have been banned a long time ago.

Also, I don't mean to point fingers at anyone, but doesn't this count as Personal attack? I mean, we don't go around calling everyone on the forum who albums a scammer just because of album scammers..

in albuming there are only two people involved.

this can be manipulated in some ways.

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masta518
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sat Apr 06, 2013 6:45 pm

GoldoaWillNotMove wrote:
Also, I don't mean to point fingers at anyone, but doesn't this count as Personal attack? I mean, we don't go around calling everyone on the forum who albums a scammer just because of album scammers..
It's not a personal attack but more like a discussion of the nature of the game. If you think this is a personal attack, might as well go on reddit or something with upvoting and a hugbox community :p

But I agree that let people do what they want for now. There's no way to be sure that this is a scam (although the terms and conditions are highly unfair to the players and there's the possibility of him asking his friends/making dummy accounts to 'win'), so I say we let people participate if they want to. If it all goes well? Someone is happy! If it's a scam? Suckers!

:p
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sGabe4
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sun Apr 07, 2013 2:12 am

Just now I saw an ad for a raffle in-game
the account was created 2 weeks ago, the player is still on chapter 1 and has only 8 card in his unit album, but has a maxed Patricia, no battles, no event participation, no nothing in the profile

still people are breaking their necks running to his "raffle" paying him TE/Luna for the off chance to win "something"

I decided that if people willingly fall for these kind of things, then whether they get scammed or not is totally on them. I don't care anymore, I just feel like they are super unfair.
I rest my case.
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Timed
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:50 am

A better raffle would be to say buy something from their shop and say add 1 te or pot to also enter their raffle thus even if you lose at least you have something.
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MythSearcher
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:00 am

Timed wrote:
A better raffle would be to say buy something from their shop and say add 1 te or pot to also enter their raffle thus even if you lose at least you have something.

This is reasonable, and actually a similar promotion was performed by a Japanese company a few years ago.
"PXcari SwXXt" (Not making ads here, censoring =)
Its a drink, and the more you buy their product (counted in ml) within the game period, the higher chance you get from the raffle.
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predator852
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:51 pm

We can't regulate everything. I never participate in raffles, because I'll never give anyone something for nothing.

Every once in a while I'll participate in auctions, that's only because everything I have stays with me until the end.

But if people CHOOSE to give something for nothing, I don't really think it's my responsibility (or any other mod/admin) to back them up when they come away with nothing.

No one here is an innocent child, we all are at least old enough to handle a smartphone and join a forum. And everyone everywhere has a responsibility to guard/use their pssesions the way they want. If that means you want to metaphorically let a robber into your house so be it.

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pknott
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:53 pm

MythSearcher wrote:
Timed wrote:
A better raffle would be to say buy something from their shop and say add 1 te or pot to also enter their raffle thus even if you lose at least you have something.

This is reasonable, and actually a similar promotion was performed by a Japanese company a few years ago.
"PXcari SwXXt" (Not making ads here, censoring =)
Its a drink, and the more you buy their product (counted in ml) within the game period, the higher chance you get from the raffle.

Groups of stores(malls) in Japan also run raffles for purchases. Take your receipt to a desk in the mall and they dispense a ball. They're almost all white. Good for a pack of tissues. Cry more.
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MythSearcher
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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:30 pm

pknott wrote:


Groups of stores(malls) in Japan also run raffles for purchases. Take your receipt to a desk in the mall and they dispense a ball. They're almost all white. Good for a pack of tissues. Cry more.

Yeah, these are simple to make and usually you have nothing to lose, for both organizer and participants.
They are not making money off entry fee, but selling actual products, the raffle is simply an added value.

In fact, come to think of it, HK got this electronic money company that gives out rebates by way of raffles, you usually earn 0.5%, but if your purchase is above a certain amount, you can then enter a raffle, and the rebate will be pumped up by a factor of 2X~30X, which, is actually a really small number, but it kinda make people happy.
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CardCaptorSophia



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PostSubject: Re: Nature of raffles   Wed Apr 10, 2013 6:05 am

WOW !!! I never knew this was here! I am offended that this community would do something like this! PUBLICLY OUT! and try and humiliate a person like this!

As you can see i am new to this game ! Which sGabe very kindly pointed out! Oh and i would like to personally thank him for attacking me in game on my wall to! you are such a kind, Caring and amazing person Smile Oh and i should thank ElysianField for concocting that great theory on how i am indeed a scammer, you are also an amazing person.

I cant believe im doing this . . . but if you must know , please, read on.


I have played fantasica previously and was still a new player, but have since had that device stolen hence why i have a new account on my new phone. When i had my old account i was selling cards on this forum. I never did battles on my old account/ and was never into collecting cards. SO whats the problem? i have played this game before so i know what cards i want and because my album count is low ? I am scammer? Really? A scammer? I dont expect you to know my life story but really? How ignorant.

This was my first ever raffle ! I THOUGHT i was being innovative in doing a raffle because i am new to this game and had never seen anyone do one before. I never knew there was a history with raffles , let alone that it was a tool used to scam people. I Honestly didn't know that there were ever other raffles and i honestly didn't see a problem with the price of my first raffle. Someone could of helped me reprice it or constructively said something but, then the people who did respond really did a good job at making me feel like a i was personally attacked and made me feel like i was indeed a scammer.

You really think a scammer would still try and proceed to do a raffle when they are called out like this?

You may think i am being greedy or whatever but thats your opinion on the matter. I believe this is a personal attack and your trying to create a negative image for me WHEN I WAS NOT THE ONE WHO SCAMMED THOSE PEOPLE WITH PREVIOUS RAFFLES! It is stupid that because other people have been scammed from this type of thing that i am a called a criminal in the same regard.

The disclaimers were there because as it states I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR PEOPLE WHO DONT WIN! And obviously to protect myself from people like this who like to put down people and make them feel like they have done something wrong when clearly i have NOT!.

I changed my event from raffles to quizzes because of the reason that it would be considered spamming in terms of how i initially planned do it. and also quizzes are more controlled on the part of the people who would potentially participate.

It worked out fair and everyone was in agreement that it was fair. Obviously the people did receive their prizes if you dont believe me contact them there info is still on the topic i did. Smile

It sickens me that i have to defend my character! Also I would like to thank you people for making my time on this forum very negative. I am strong in what i believe in and do not believe in ripping others off! The raffle was a gamble which people who participated understood THAT FACT! And they were fine at the chance that they could lose.

SO WHATS THE PROBLEM! IF YOU GUYS WANTED TO KNOW MY LIFE STORY YOU REALLY SHOULD OF ASKED ME YOURSELF! But then its really none of your business , thank you for making assumptions and judging me because i decided to make a raffle. Oh and also thank you for this wonderful welcome to the forum! Being talked about in a negative post is very welcoming Smile
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